Red
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Posts: 40
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Post by Red on Apr 3, 2012 6:58:34 GMT
No No not a sucking egg moment ;D happy to take advice from an experienced FZ racer (I watch my collection of IOM DVDs quite often dreaming of riding there one day. Thats REAL racing and you've been there done that and survived- legend.
I haven't even had the engine in the frame yet so the rod is still 400mm long waiting to be cut to length and tapped etc to fit the engine. I fully expect to have to tweek the design, I made the lever so if needed I can shorten and use the holes closer to the pivot if needed. At present its about right for my size 11 clod hoppers. It will certainly be lower.
The ball joint has quite a bit of X and Y movement and appears to have enough to get to the engine and function but I wont know till the engine is in. Fingers crossed it works out. Dont want start a habit of making everything 3 times!!! Cheers Red
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Red
New Member
Posts: 40
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Post by Red on Jul 5, 2012 7:15:56 GMT
Well finally starting to get a bit of time on the old girl again. Bit of progress in the weekend Finally found some pre 89 class legal calipers that fit nicely. They are 4spot Tokicos, usually fitted to late 80's GSXR/RGV etc. I had purchased some FZR1000 4spot sumitomos but I wasn't happy with the size of the adapter plate and how far the caliper ended up away from the fork. Probably just paranoid but I didn't want any flex. Also mounted radiator overflow tank under rear seat. And modified the front tank mounts to raise the tank. I've read this improves airflow to the K&N pods? Got a weeks leave coming up so hoping to start stripping the engine. Cheers Red
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Post by Graham on Jul 5, 2012 9:23:44 GMT
Nice touch with the tank mounts Red. I altered mine but not enough so it isn't very noticeable. I believe it was done in conjunction (my big word for this week) with a certain exhaust & jet kit. Forget the make now but Gavin might know more about that. Should definitely flow more air under your tank now! Just hope it doesn't act like a sail & try to lift itself off the bike when you're flat out or you might accidentally set a new fastest wheelie record!
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Post by fz750horse on Jul 5, 2012 12:39:16 GMT
I know Simon Baggett raised the tank on his - I thought it was something to do with the 1FN tank being different but you could be right, it might have been to do with airflow. I've got Ram Air filters on velocity stacks (I couldn't find K&N ones to fit the stacks) and there is plenty of room for them under a 2mg tank. Steve Spencer, who prepared Simon's bike, advocated open stacks so I guess that's what Simon was using.
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Post by Graham on Jul 5, 2012 13:30:28 GMT
Lifted from classicmechanics.com page;
Decent aftermarket exhausts are scarce. Motad’s race pipe added 10bhp if you also raised the front of the fuel tank half a centimetre. But was loud enough to deafen Lemmy. Motad don’t build noisy pipes for the road and the limited numbers they built for racing were very carefully controlled. But some of the handcrafted pipework did escape the paddock and (literally) caused headaches for both riders, villagers and coppers everywhere.
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Red
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Posts: 40
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Post by Red on Jul 6, 2012 10:03:37 GMT
Cheers For the info Gents, One of my concerns probably unfounded was that with no airbox hot air from the radiator/engine would get sucked into the intakes. I figured that more fresh air flowing into the area has got to help. Time will tell I guess. I went with the K&N's as they offer a reasonable increase in HP, not as much as velocity stacks. I figured the good filtration will help keep the engine running a bit longer.. important on my budget. I'll try to find pics of a motad race pipe, 10hp sounds good ;D. Plan is to use the stock headers with a freer flowing end can for a start. This will get me up and running sooner. I want to make my own approximate copy of a Gibson like Mr Horses below. I found a pic of the other headers below which intrigue me, the connection of cylinders is different to most 4-1's. Need to do some research to see if this layout offers any advantage. Just found a pic of one of NZ's best riders Aaron Slight ( ex WSBK) winning the Wanganui street races over here on an FZ back in 86. Apparently he had to make the FZ reeeeal wide to kee the GSXR's behind him. Cheers Red
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Post by fz750horse on Jul 6, 2012 12:30:46 GMT
I think the biggest advantage of the side-by-side headers is ground clearance. It's hard to get oil containment around the over-and-under Gibson design. I had three goes and eventually settled on this, which seems to be ok: picasaweb.google.com/FZ750Horse/BrandsTrackEvening270612#5760276368592006786Steve spencer was working on a design similar to the one in your picture, which I think was a factory design for F1 racing, but a lot of his tooling and prototypes got stolen and I think he gave up. Lazer's pipe for 1FN models looked like this (4-2-1) but the 2mg one was straightforward 4-1. 4-2-1 was generally reckoned to be better and a 10bhp increase seems to be about normal for race pipe and intake mods, maybe a bit more for earlier bikes which start from a lower base.
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Red
New Member
Posts: 40
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Post by Red on Jul 6, 2012 22:56:31 GMT
Cheers Gavin,
Fortunately we dont have to run oil containment (yet) so ground clearance hopefully wouldn't be an issue. From what your saying I'll probably make a side by side as they will be a lot easier for me to make. I can just get my local exhaust guys to copy and CNC bend the standard 2mg headers in a larger diameter. After that the joins from 4 headers to the 2-1 section should be easy enough. What diameter is the tubing on your pipes? I was thinking 1.5-1.75inch tube should be OK.
Cheers Red
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Post by fz750horse on Jul 7, 2012 8:37:58 GMT
Header O.D. is 40mm, inters 46mm O.D., end section 56mm O.D. Pipe wall is 1.2mm. If you go too big on the headers it buggers up the gas flow around 4000rpm - 5000rpm and causes a massive flat spot - Microns did this. Not really a problem for racing but I don't think there's any advantage at the top end, so best avoided.
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Red
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Posts: 40
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Post by Red on Jul 7, 2012 21:11:26 GMT
Thanks Mate, I'll start collecting tubing in those sizes.
I dummy fitted the engine yesterday along with carbs and filters, looks like the tank did need to be raised to clear the K&N pods.
Being a 2mg I have the coils mounted on the outside of the frame down tubes, this look a bit odd poking out below my 86 fairing.
I noticed earlier models must have them mounted somewhere else, anyone know if they were shifted for a reason? did they overheat in the earlier location? or was it just cosmetic? I'd like to re mount the coils under the tank around the headstock before I get the frame painted but dont want to have any overheating or other issues.
Cheers Red
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Red
New Member
Posts: 40
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Post by Red on Jul 7, 2012 21:15:14 GMT
Hi Red, Don't know if you have tried the gear change lever yet but three things strike me. 1. The lever is way too high and need to be angled down somewhat. 2. The change rod need to be behind the lever as one restricts the movement of the other. 3. You may need to increase the actuation point of the lever too your foot will move a fair bit to change gears. Apologies if this is a sucking eggs moment. Looks like you were right , rod does interfere with lever. Looks like my tradition of making every part 3 times will continue DOH!! I'll wait until bike is back together before making V3, might simplify design and run a lever rearward directly off the spline for race pattern. I ran a race pattern my bucket racer for the first time, surprised how much better it is out of corners ( once I started to remember which way the gears went!) Cheers Red
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Post by fz750horse on Jul 7, 2012 22:03:13 GMT
I fitted Dynacoils under the tank on my 2mg - no problems
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Post by sparkes on Aug 12, 2012 7:54:36 GMT
Re. IFN pipe pipe/tank lifting etc. The pipe, carb kit and tank mounting backet adaptors mentioned earlier in this thread were produced by Motad, part number was YZ7R. Sadly they no are longer available and they don't seem to have jigs etc. for them. I have one on my Superstock spec 1FN trackday bike, It's a 4 into 2 into 1 design, a mix of stainless header, nickel plated centre section and stainless outlet and silencer. Headers are 35.25mm o/d,link pipe outlett o/d is 41.5mm. If anybody is interested next time it's off the bike I'll measure it in detail and get some images. They were available back in the day (mid 80's until the early 90's) for competition only - had to send a copy of my ACU licence with the order before Motad would supply. The carb kit consisted of mains (130's), air correctors (sorry, I don't know sizes for these) and brackets to lift the front of the tank.
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Post by sparkes on Aug 12, 2012 8:21:13 GMT
Ooops - posted the reply before I'd finished it, I'll try to complete it now before I press the wrong button again. The carb kit was designed to run with the air box but no filter. I've run mine with no air box, open standard air box trumpets, an ali heatshield over the top frame rails and the front of the tank jacked up around 50mm on the front mounts. Worked well with a good spread of power. Now running it with the tank down in the standard position and K&N individual filters. Feels as if it has more top end now (inlet length change possibly?) but I've never dyno'ed it so I can't be certain.
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Post by sparkes on Aug 12, 2012 8:32:40 GMT
Bugger - posted instead of preview yet again!!!! Anyhow, if anybody want's a bit more info I'm happy to share what little I have - the racetracks (and roads) of this world need more FZ's.... And the system isn't that noisy, 98dB with a home made dB killer and 105dB without.
Regards,
John
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